Guest Maj Millard Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 The computer illiterate ones ( and research shows areound 2-3% at best of pilots) can subscribe and receive the paper copy if the choose like you, to remain in the dark ages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ev17ifly2 Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 One word says it all major ONLINE Hey bull, why are you concerned about this anyway. In one of your rants on another thread you said you had given up flying. Just make sure the next pursuit or sport you take up has an association which offers free membership, free paper magazine and caters for technical Luddites 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 Hey bull, why are you concerned about this anyway. In one of your rants on another thread you said you had given up flying.Just make sure the next pursuit or sport you take up has an association which offers free membership, free paper magazine and caters for technical Luddites Nobody has asked for any thing free, ev1 all that members ask for is that ALL members are catered to not just the LSA and quasi ga mob,,,And i,ll still continue to represent the MEMBERS who dont use computers.AS my pilots certificate is current until november so i,m still a MEMBER 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gandalph Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 The computer illiterate ones ( and research shows areound 2-3% at best of pilots) can subscribe and receive the paper copy if the choose like you, to remain in the dark ages. Ross, I understand your irritation at some of the inflammatory material being posted here but the language of your response was not appropriate for a member of the Board. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 The computer illiterate ones ( and research shows areound 2-3% at best of pilots) can subscribe and receive the paper copy if the choose like you, to remain in the dark ages. At EXTRA cost as these members are still paying for those that are computer literate to recieve theirs via pdf correct????Or they should be given a decrease in fees as this is only fair as they will not use the electronic version themselves so why should they have to pay for it???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andys@coffs Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 bull it doesn't matter what you fly the moment you use your cross country endorsement you need to be compliant not only with RAAus rule but CASA rules around flight preparation as well. How you can do that these days without an Internet connection is beyond me. I agree that there will be those that might prefer to not be computer literate, but understand that if they make that choice they are choosing to ignore the rules..... The magazine is of secondary import to that whole reality... If they are prepared to ignore the rules around being prepared and briefed before setting off, are they the same members who ignore other rules and contribute to our unacceptably high fatality levels? Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 We decided on behalf of the members that the magazine must pay for itself an become cost neutral to the organisation. This line from one of your earlier posts says it all dont you think????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 bull it doesn't matter what you fly the moment you use your cross country endorsement you need to be compliant not only with RAAus rule but CASA rules around flight preparation as well. How you can do that these days without an Internet connection is beyond me. I agree that there will be those that might prefer to not be computer literate, but understand that if they make that choice they are choosing to ignore the rules..... The magazine is of secondary import to that whole reality...If they are prepared to ignore the rules around being prepared and briefed before setting off, are they the same members who ignore other rules and contribute to our unacceptably high fatality levels? Andy If that is the case ,,,WHY do we have so many of our recent accidents represented by LSA,s and a couple of instructers ???????Who should be by the very nature of their aircraft :computer literate????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhysmcc Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 I would not be happy to pay an extra $90 a year onto of my membership because some people choose (for what ever reason) not to access the magazine online. I did the survey regarding this issue and also made sure my rep plus other board members were aware of my opinion. Besides the rants on here bull, what contact have you made with the Board or Management regarding your concerns? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 bull it doesn't matter what you fly the moment you use your cross country endorsement you need to be compliant not only with RAAus rule but CASA rules around flight preparation as well. How you can do that these days without an Internet connection is beyond me. I agree that there will be those that might prefer to not be computer literate, but understand that if they make that choice they are choosing to ignore the rules..... The magazine is of secondary import to that whole reality...If they are prepared to ignore the rules around being prepared and briefed before setting off, are they the same members who ignore other rules and contribute to our unacceptably high fatality levels? Andy Also Andy the drive for ALL pilots of RAA to go electric is not represented enough to CASA about open cockpit navigation and the use of ozrunways or other electronic media /gps .....You cant have one without the other ah Andy.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhysmcc Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 CASA already lets you use Ozrunways (i.e. as a MAP), you still need to know where you are on the map though (the little plane icon helps). Edit: I should add, the same device that runs your Ozrunways, will also load the online magazine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 CASA already lets you use Ozrunways (i.e. as a MAP), you still need to know where you are on the map though (the little plane icon helps).Edit: I should add, the same device that runs your Ozrunways, will also load the online magazine. correct , but the requirement to carry expensive latest PAPER charts that are tucked away on MOST raa aircraft on XC flights in the glove box of LSA,s or under the seat in open cockpit TRUE real ULTRALIGHTS and NEVER used for navigation,,,now i know that i,ll be shot down for that comment but please be HONEST with yourselves......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhysmcc Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 You don't need maps, ozrunways is fine for our recreational use. As long as you can show the working device with app should you be ramp checked. Personally i print out an A4 copy (print screen style) incase I have any issues inflight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 You don't need maps, ozrunways is fine for our recreational use. As long as you can show the working device with app should you be ramp checked. Personally i print out an A4 copy (print screen style) incase I have any issues inflight. WRONG check your requirements from casa mate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhysmcc Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 Private pilots can use tablet devices as a primary means of in-flight documentation, as long as the documentation is from an authorised source (such as Airservices, OzRunways, AvPlan, Jeppesen, Lido, Navtech or Aerostratos). There is no requirement for secondary source. If your primary doesn't work then you don't meet the regulation. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 Private pilots can use tablet devices as a primary means of in-flight documentation, as long as the documentation is from an authorised source (such as Airservices, OzRunways, AvPlan, Jeppesen, Lido, Navtech or Aerostratos).There is no requirement for secondary source. If your primary doesn't work then you don't meet the regulation. Try that at a flyin ramp check and see how far your theory goes........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happyflyer Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 Try that at a flyin ramp check and see how far your theory goes........... He will pass with flying colours. For private flying CASA doesn't require any backups to an electronic device. http://www.casa.gov.au/scripts/nc.dll?WCMS:STANDARD:1001:pc=PC_101203 What is the legal requirement for a backup to my EFB? For AOC holders, a backup is mandatory. It is at the operator’s discretion whether the backup is another EFB, or hardcopy charts, maps and documents. The requirements of CAR 233(1)(h) are clear in that the pilot must have the latest documents from an approved vendor readily accessible. It is the readily accessible requirement that prompts the need for backup and all pilots need to ensure how they meet that requirement in the event of a tablet malfunction. An electronic device such as another tablet is an acceptable backup. Private pilots can use tablet devices as a primary means of in-flight documentation, as long as the documentation is from an authorised source (such as Airservices, OzRunways, AvPlan, Jeppesen, Lido, Navtech or Aerostratos). 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 Bull...I can see you now in a ditch after an accident screaming....but RAAus didn't tell me about that AD... I hate to tell you this but this is your responsibility to check current AD's that affect your aircraft and the regulations you fly under and for YOU to act upon them...same as if you go fishing, it is up to you to know the current regulations and no fish zones, they don't send me letters in the mail to tell me things have changed, I normally go onto the website from time to time and check, ignorance is no excuse, don't try and blame others for your inaction, it's in your own interests to do so and your friends and loved one's that fly with you.David David[/ I do recieve a paper magazine from the Qld govenment organisation that advises all master fisherman of changes to legislation and such ,we also recieve via snail mail on paper any changes to the great barrier reef marine park etc as in green zones or any changes we also recieve via paper mail any coastal chart changes as all proffessional mariners be they charter /fishing or tugs or other so you are incorrect on that one mate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 He will pass with flying colours. For private flying CASA doesn't require any backups to an electronic device. But according to the latest RAA magazine WE are .................................. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happyflyer Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 But according to the latest RAA magazine WE are .................................. I didn't see where it said that. However, we are governed by CASA with some extra requirements from RAAus that must be in the RAAus Ops manual. Can you tell me where this was mentioned in the RAAus magazine? I would like to follow that up. Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Maj Millard Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 This line from one of your earlier posts says it all dont you think????? That's why we are where we are Bull...and the members elected us to be there by the way...to make decisions on behalf, and for the benefit of the organization and the members. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 I didn't see where it said that. However, we are governed by CASA with some extra requirements from RAAus that must be in the RAAus Ops manual. Can you tell me where this was mentioned in the RAAus magazine? I would like to follow that up. Cheers. I think it was the may edition under the safe explanation of safe ACCESSABLE etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DGL Fox Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 David[/ I do recieve a paper magazine from the Qld govenment organisation that advises all master fisherman of changes to legislation and such ,we also recieve via snail mail on paper any changes to the great barrier reef marine park etc as in green zones or any changes we also recieve via paper mail any coastal chart changes as all proffessional mariners be they charter /fishing or tugs or other so you are incorrect on that one mate Bull, I am not a professional fisherman or a career flyer, I am amateur fisherman and a recreational flyer and I can assure you that I do not get any of things you allude to in the post or email, as I said it is your responsibility as a rec flyer to stay abreast of the latest news whether you have internet access of not, so I am not incorrect as you say within what I do. Bull you need to stop feeling sorry for yourself and doing the woo is me stuff and just get on with flying and stop complaining about really nothing, you are not achieving anything doing what you are doing, if you have a gripe you should be sitting down with your local RAAus rep and be discussing all of this with him and not doing it here. David 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 Bull,I am not a professional fisherman or a career flyer, I am amateur fisherman and a recreational flyer and I can assure you that I do not get any of things you allude to in the post or email, as I said it is your responsibility as a rec flyer to stay abreast of the latest news whether you have internet access of not, so I am not incorrect as you say within what I do. Bull you need to stop feeling sorry for yourself and doing the woo is me stuff and just get on with flying and stop complaining about really nothing, you are not achieving anything doing what you are doing, if you have a gripe you should be sitting down with your local RAAus rep and be discussing all of this with him and not doing it here. David Try it David ,they dont listen unless its about the latest LSA on the market and if they can get it for a song try it one day.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andys@coffs Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 Bull So to be clear, you are saying you have done exactly that? Who and when? Andy P.s please answer the question! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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