bull Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 BullSo to be clear, you are saying you have done exactly that? Who and when? Andy P.s please answer the question!,you know where i live work it out....................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 This is not the issue ,the issue is Members ,dont you think a members society should consult and listen to members Andy,as Major has all but told all our older MEMBERS that PAY the same fee,s as our newer LSA members that they live in the DARK ages and should at an advanced age suddenly LEARN how to use a computer AND navigate around the RAA site {which by the way even the younger MEMBERS who have grown up with computers can not work out] should they not be be treated with the same respect? And be catered for by RAA as well as those that DO know how to use a computer? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff13 Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 Bull Maybe you could use the same computer that you a using to complain with to keep up to date. Just Sayin' 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Bull Maybe you could use the same computer that you a using to complain with to keep up to date.Just Sayin' Thanks for that brainwave Geoff ,as you can see I do know how to use a computer but am standing up for those that dont and can not have their concerns heard because the only way this forum or RAA will entertain an objection is via a COMPUTER cant you see the oxymoron there? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gandalph Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 ......the only way this forum ............will entertain an objection is via a COMPUTER ....... Well Bull, I think it's kinda accepted by the vast majority of people, even those that don't use the Internet, that the only way to communicate on an Internet forum is via a computer. Not having a go at you but I think your anger is cloudng the points you're trying to make here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ev17ifly2 Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Bull, who do you spend most of your time flying with, Wilbur or OrvIlle ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Well Bull, I think it's kinda accepted by the vast majority of people, even those that don't use the Internet, that the only way to communicate on an Internet forum is via a computer. Not having a go at you but I think your anger is cloudng the points you're trying to make here. Agreed and thanks for that info, i,ll take it on board,,,as to my involvement with RAA it is at an end as i have sold my aircraft and will not fly until another breakaway group for true ULTRALIGHTS is formed and the RAA go spiralling down in flames from the stupid direction that they have taken and the worst thing about its imminent demise is, its all its own fault not the members as others have decided the direction for them with out asking them about it .So good luck with it all and i,m sorry for the true ultralight pilots dragged along for the ride to the death of RAA sorry and see you all Bull aka Scott Evans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Bull, who do you spend most of your time flying with, Wilbur or OrvIlle ? Mostly by myself as my aircraft was a single seater and most lsa,s like the supposed majority of RAA aircraft are ,would stall and fall out of the sky at the speeds of a TRUE ULTRALIGHT cheers 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andys@coffs Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Thanks for that brainwave Geoff ,as you can see I do know how to use a computer but am standing up for those that dont and can not have their concerns heard because the only way this forum or RAA will entertain an objection is via a COMPUTER cant you see the oxymoron there? Where's this oxymoron? I've a good mind to give him a piece of my mind! But you seem to have already taken care of it..,a few times over! Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Where's this oxymoron? I've a good mind to give him a piece of my mind! But you seem to have already taken care of it..,a few times over!Andy Andy you dont see the problem about raa asking members about having matters addressed by computer but only allowing answers by online as in on a computer,,,,,dont you think that those that cant or wont use a computer are being treated fair ,,,really your arguements mean $%%^&all to me now as i,n not involved or punnisable by the raa police now as i,ve cut my cord,BUT i,ll still give you and other board members curry when you need it to help those members that live in the dark ages as a board member has stated ah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gandalph Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 .....i have sold my aircraft and will not fly until another breakaway group for true ULTRALIGHTS is formed and the RAA go spiralling down in flames..... So just to clarify Bull, before you finally do leave us. You say you won't fly again until someone forms a group for ultralights and the RAA has gone down in flames. So you need a new AUF to form AND the RAA to go out of business before you'll fly again? Both? Really? Seriously? You see what I meant before about your anger getting in the way of making sense? You're not doing your cause any favours with silly statements like that. If you don't like where the RAA has gone then by all means leave and form your own speciality group, but please, please keep your spite, hatred and denigration of other flyers under control. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhysmcc Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Just to clarify bull, the survey regarding the magazine going digital was both online and included in the March magazine, the option to fill out the form and mail it back was there. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bull Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 So just to clarify Bull, before you finally do leave us. You say you won't fly again until someone forms a group for ultralights and the RAA has gone down in flames. So you need a new AUF to form AND the RAA to go out of business before you'll fly again? Both?Really? Seriously? You see what I meant before about your anger getting in the way of making sense? You're not doing your cause any favours with silly statements like that. If you don't like where the RAA has gone then by all means leave and form your own speciality group, but please, please keep your spite, hatred and denigration of other flyers under control.[ So just to clarify Bull, before you finally do leave us. You say you won't fly again until someone forms a group for ultralights and the RAA has gone down in flames. So you need a new AUF to form AND the RAA to go out of business before you'll fly again? Both?Really? Seriously? You see what I meant before about your anger getting in the way of making sense? You're not doing your cause any favours with silly statements like that. If you don't like where the RAA has gone then by all means leave and form your own speciality group, but please, please keep your spite, hatred and denigration of other flyers under control. Sorry about that i should say as the RAA spiralles down because the true ultralighters have left and casa wakes up to the scamming ex ga mob cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gandalph Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Ok. I figured you didn't mean it they way it came out. Maybe you need to have a cuppa between writing something and pressing "send"? Sorry you've decided to quit flying. I wish you well. Stay calm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farri Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 If they are prepared to ignore the rules around being prepared and briefed before setting off, are they the same members who ignore other rules and contribute to our unacceptably high fatality levels?Andy Andy, correctly me if you wish, but I don`t see your question as being relative or appropriate!!!...As I see it, your question is more appropriate to an accident investigation, rather than, whether or not, an RA-Aus member is computer literate or not, or, how they prefer to receive Sport Pilot. Frank. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andys@coffs Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Frank Its my view that the two are related... If being prepared and briefed for a x country flight requires that you access area briefings for weather and Notams, and you can now (for last few years) only get those from NAIPS online then how does someone who is not computer literate fulfil his obligations to RAAus and CASA in terms of pre flight planning? If they are literate enough to get the required NAIPS briefings then they have the computer and the internet access to allow access to sport pilot. I absolutely agree and understand that wanting to vs being able to read sport pilot online is very different, but once you cross over from impossible to possible to access then nothing other than "Don't want to" is the real reason. Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coljones Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Andy, correctly me if you wish, but I don`t see your question as being relative or appropriate!!!...As I see it, your question is more appropriate to an accident investigation, rather than, whether or not, an RA-Aus member is computer literate or not, or, how they prefer to receive Sport Pilot.Frank. Having a computer gives one the collateral of being able to call up and read all sorts of publications, including Air Law. We don't, now, have time (so I am told) to stand around and trade war stories and fixes so a good place to do that is here, using a computer. There is probably an argument that those on low speed, low capacity links should get a better deal, maybe a text only electronic copy (I don't look at many ads). But low speeds/ low capacity is more a question for OPTUS (as the cando carrier) to answer as RAA and its members are just meat in this commercial sandwich. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farri Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 FrankIts my view that the two are related... If being prepared and briefed for a x country flight requires that you access area briefings for weather and Notams, and you can now (for last few years) only get those from NAIPS online then how does someone who is not computer literate fulfil his obligations to RAAus and CASA in terms of pre flight planning?.Andy Andy, I can agree with you on that and do understand, but, then that means, (I think?), anyone who is not computer literate shouldn`t be holding an RA-Aus cross country endorsement????....Where dose that leave the flight training schools, if they issue the endorsement, to anyone who isn`t computer literate????...Will a computer course now be required, for anyone who isn`t computer literate if they want a cross country endorsement, or, no computer literacy, no endorsement? Frank 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coljones Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Air Law says that if you are going to do XC then you need consider Wx and NOTAMS and come to an informed decision. Do you have a non-computer related solution? Or do you get a computer literate person with access to a computer to do it for you? If I were to be running an FTF, accessing and interpretation of Wx and NOTAMS would be on my syllabus. If I was renting a plane to a qualified pilot I would want to know if they understood what they were doing before I handed the keys over. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farri Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 If I was renting a plane to a qualified pilot I would want to know if they understood what they were doing before I handed the keys over. If the pilot is qualified, would you not expect that they know, what they are supposed to know?...If they don`t know, what does that say about the FTF that trained the pilot and the system that issued the endorsement? Frank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coljones Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 If the pilot is qualified, would you not expect that they know, what they are supposed to know?...If they don`t know, what does that say about the FTF that trained the pilot and the system that issued the endorsement?Frank. We expect many things in life, having that expectation met is a different thing (human factor). Part of that knowing is hopping (or getting someone else to) onto a computer and reading the weather and NOTAMS appropriate to their proposed flight and incorporating that info into their plans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andys@coffs Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Andy, I can agree with you on that and do understand, but, then that means, (I think?), anyone who is not computer literate shouldn`t be holding an RA-Aus cross country endorsement????....Where dose that leave the flight training schools, if they issue the endorsement, to anyone who isn`t computer literate????...Will a computer course now be required, for anyone who isn`t computer literate if they want a cross country endorsement, or, no computer literacy, no endorsement?Frank No, the FTF has to teach you what to do, and ensure your competent in doing it which in my view includes going on line and getting those briefings. Once judged competent it's up to you to do what you must from that point onwards, even if the delivery mechanisms change. If you aren't computer literate today and don't know how to get an online briefing today then that is no ones fault but your own. If you can't rectify that, then hand back your endorsement and or certificate because you are technically incapable of following the rules. It's that black and white! Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
planesmaker Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Ever heard of telephone briefing? Or fax? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andys@coffs Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Yeah I have and went looking to see if they are still offered alternatives. I couldn't find any details of either. I assumed they were both dead. However I looked at the latest Visual Flight Guide and find that they still exist today with full access details of how one gets an account to use is published in the VFRG. So...correct there are still alternates available to online NAIPS and my "You should leave" if your computer illiterate statement is wrong....for the moment Sorry Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 This is getting to the ridiculous stage, where people are trying to make an argument, on behalf of others, who are saying nothing in non-electronic circles. Someone who can afford to pay current hourly rates to keep up recency in an aircraft, can afford to pay for an adsl plan, and download the full magazine orvernight while they are asleep, then save it and read it at their leisure. If they don't want to pay out monthly for a higher speed plan they can buy a prepaid mobile modem for about $80.00 and download at 3G or 4G speed. If they are in a 3G, 4G black hole, and in my travels over eastern and central Australia, I know there are thousands, they can use the mobile modem when they are in town, download the magazine and save it for less than they'd pay for a paper mag, and weeks before they'd get it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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