ducksrus Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 Hi Everyone, At some point in the future my missus and I want to own our very own airstrip, not sure where yet but a nice country location on land big enough to be able to create a grass strip, build a hangar and a comfy cottage home. I would also like to put a few old caravans on the property so people who may fly in, could stay overnight. It's been a dream of ours for some time. There are a few unknowns for us, with regards to the legalities of forming a strip on your own property so I thought it might be a good topic for dicussion, esp from people who have done it already. My main query is, do you need council / local authority approval to make an airstrip on your own property ? One guy I talked to a while ago, said that he put a strip in and then a neighbour complained, then a local council guy came around and said he couldn"t have a strip, this guy (the strip owner) said that "I use my aircraft to enter and leave my property, just as I do my vehicle, it's my right to do that and there is nothing council can do". Does anyone have any experience with this, or maybe can shed more light on the subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Nooyen Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 I have a strip in an aviation friendly town. Build a "Machinery Shed", not a hangar. (What you keep in it is your business). I am also lucky that I have great neighbors, and swamp at both ends that cannot be readily built on. You must fly at least 500' above the ground, Unless taking off or landing. If you can get 500' above your own property, that's best. Having a quiet aircraft helps too, and don't do circuits above your neighbors houses, go to a busy airfield. Don't call it an airstrip, just have a well maintained paddock. Regards John N. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damkia Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 A 300m "cricket pitch" or "golf hole" 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Isaac Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 You do NOT need Council approval to land and takeoff aircraft from your own property or to allow visitors to use for visiting in same way motor vehicles can arrive and leave your property without Council approval. Your neighbours cannot legally stop you, but they can object and cause trouble, so best to agree with them that you will fly neigbourly. As suggested above, build a machinery shed and in most rural jurisdictions you don't need Council approval for that either. Be be sure for the sake of your own insurance to build a two way strip and use the Aeroplane Landing Area (ALA) guidelines which allows you to calculate the dimensions for your particular aircraft performance. Otherwise if you have an accident, the insurer may be able to legally deny the claim. By the way, if you use and a paddock as an ALA, you neighbour can be prevented from building an obstruction in your approach/departure gradient. Do a search on this subject on this forum, there has already been a wealth of previous discussion on this issue. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XP503 Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 This was my strip before I moved to Boonah. Lots of fun but no room for error 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulh Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 Not sure I agree that councils have no say, they can make life difficult if a neighbour has the ear of an influential person. I recommend investigating the town planning scheme of the local authority for the area in which you are considering the dream home and private airstrip. (A dream for many I think) In QLD the planning legislation is quite powerful to deal with major land use developments etc so the council planning schemes which are built on this legislation can have clauses to control any activities that are not mainstream, or that some others might think is too noisy, or poses a safety risk or spoils the view or that the bat colony won't like etc. (this is from experience) The planning scheme should be on the local council web site. Then I suggest going to the local council office and asking some questions in a hypothetical way, if its looking iffy then get the local town planning consultant to advise you, cheap insurance before signing a purchase contract and the dream becomes spoilt by arguing with bureaucracy Having said that I have landed at two unofficial back yard strips and know of a few more, great fun as long as the wind is on your nose and the fences are low! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frank marriott Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 Watch the EPA if it involves removing a tree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Isaac Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 You do NOT need Council approval to land and takeoff aircraft from your own property or to allow visitors to use for visiting in same way motor vehicles can arrive and leave your property without Council approval. Your neighbours cannot legally stop you, but they can object and cause trouble, so best to agree with them that you will fly neigbourly.As suggested above, build a machinery shed and in most rural jurisdictions you don't need Council approval for that either. Be be sure for the sake of your own insurance to build a two way strip and use the Aeroplane Landing Area (ALA) guidelines which allows you to calculate the dimensions for your particular aircraft performance. Otherwise if you have an accident, the insurer may be able to legally deny the claim. By the way, if you use and a paddock as an ALA, you neighbour can be prevented from building an obstruction in your approach/departure gradient. Do a search on this subject on this forum, there has already been a wealth of previous discussion on this issue. To clarify, I am specifically referring to rural land, I wouldn't try it in a 5 acre allotment among a whole lot of others. Again I suggest to search the other threads, there was a lot of legal advice on those and some from some very experienced people. I would NOT go near Council until you have done your research and even then if I had rural land I also wouldn't go anywhere near Council ... you don't need to. It is just a paddock that meets the minimal dimensions as spelled out in the ALA guidelines that is all. If it meets the right dimensions for YOUR aircraft, you can legally land and take off from it. To suggest you need approval from Council for this purpose is like suggesting you need approval from Council to drive your D7 across any of your paddocks. Aircraft can be a normal part of rural activity as is having a 4WD. DONT call it an airfield, it is just a landing strip (ALA) and don't do any commercial aviation activity from it unless you are an AG pilot and happen to own the land and it is part of a larger rural holding. Again I suggest read the threads on this subject already on this forum. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teckair Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 The most important thing to do is keep the neighbours on side. Go and visit them before you start flying tell them about your planned strip, ask if they have any concerns, find out if you need to avoid anyone's house, invite them over to check out your plane, take them flying if possible, make it clear to them they can come to you with any complaints. As has been previously said best on rural acreage not in amongst 5 acre blocks. If you can do this you will be right and there will be no need to involve the council. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyerme Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 I own a small 40 acre semi-rural property.I did all the research before putting the strip in and found The council have NO say. nore do your neighbours or police .Only CASA can put a stop to it.I have a 350mtr srtip,live 500 meters from town and have had no complaints in the 6 years Ive been here.You need council approval for a hanger (and most likely will be denied) but A machinery shed is fine,I have a 40x20 machinery shed for my girl. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camel Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 Some rural land has specific uses prohibited eg aerodromes and helipads, the zone that does not have this is Zone 1 (A3) Agriculture Rural Protection Zone, in my area anyway. Do not ask to put in an airstrip as it will be refused as it is not agriculture, but as has been said make a nice smooth area and go for it also don't piss your neigbours off as any noise complaint is sure to stop any flying activity also there is a regulation on take off and landing distances to neighbours, I think it is 300 feet from any house but you will need to check also one way strips are not covered by any insurer unless you can pre-arrange cover. If you talk to any one about flying be sure to use the word "occasional" and do not contemplate circuits also put a white cross out so you don't get unexpected visitors and also this can protect you from being sued for an unserviceable airstrip. As one does before anyone lands he emails an indemnity form they must sign before use. I am in the process of build and having my piece of paradise but I am in a flood prone area and recent rain is holding up progress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ignition Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 I agree fully with David, the councils like to think they have a say, but as far as I am aware they don't, Aviation is controlled by Federal Government (ie. CASA). I suggest you take a look at CAAP 92-1 (1) - Authorised Landing Areas - https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:AeviTOr0ZRIJ:www.casa.gov.au/download/caaps/ops/92_1.pdf+&hl=en&gl=au&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESgDCAnvN-NvpdeTqgTRaYM6rL7venu-R-jRoSZCoZ4RONVXLCC1zM9zVyYN6R2DMMN3VXMQalpvIClP8pfGKnjKth7XN3oppLxmuqX2uqYvgOfXkfIqsdWzn3hdiaPa9DSDlLDK&sig=AHIEtbTWhLGbvAsy5DEQuBnfrMsOsTje6g Keeping in mind this is only an advisory document, however it is best to try and stick as close to ALA specs as possible for insurance reasons. You typically need land owners permission, which in your case, it will be your own land. Another good document to refer to is CAR 1988 - CAR 92 - http://www.comlaw.gov.au/Details/F2012C00622/Html/Volume_3#_Toc334536848 Despite David saying don't do any commercial activity, although it would be reasonable to avoid it (think Liability Insurance), it isn't illegal to operate commercial operations at an ALA (as stated in CAAP 92-1 (1)) I too would avoid mentioning anything aviation related to the council, there is absolutely no need for a DA Approval, you are just mowing a paddock, and Machinery Sheds are the way to go. Keep the neighbours happy by avoiding low flight over their houses, take them for the occasional flight, offer them a few bottles of wine every now and then, make sure they understand you won't have any large aircraft flying in and assuming they aren't the NIMBY creatures found in some locations, they should be fine with it. When talking about your airstrip to other people, call it a paddock - might reduce the chance of people trying to make life difficult for you. If you decide to buy land in Victoria, this court case is a good reference: http://www.austlii.edu.au/cgi-bin/sinodisp/au/cases/vic/VCAT/2005/2267.html?query=^upson All in all, mow a paddock, keep the neighbours happy and have fun. 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Communications Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 Steve When I bought my property I didn't even think about the council then in regards to the landing strip as from what I had heard they didnt really care basically what David Issac has said. When I got the plans done for the sewerage system lodged and had the council dudes out for inspections I asked them about it all and they basically said "dont care". My main strip does head towards the neighbours house but I get everyone to turn away from the house before they get there. The neighbour doesn't really care the only thing he did say was he hopes a plane crashes into the house that way he can get a new house out of it. His house is pretty run down it is the original "Ringwood Station" homestead that all the blocks were cut up from the original 3000 acres, he is ok I haven't had any drama. The other neighbour who is about 1km away from the strips asked me if his brother could land there in his Jab...had to tell him no as the strip isn't long enough. As you know my strips are more for stol type aircraft even though they are just 400 mtrs each. Many types could use it. I have had 5 save and 2 of 701 land there and it is fine for them of course heaps of room. There is another thing about building the bundy shire require approvals for all buildings apparently but I did broach the council guy about they can't ask for any approvals if the building is more than 200 metres from any boundary. He did tell me that he had heard of that but didn't give me a definitive answer he seemed to want to avoid the question so it probably is true. I think it really depends on how big your property is if it is more than 100 acres then I am pretty sure there really isnt too much drama as any houses are a reasonable distance away. Mine is 125 acres (50 hectares) and is heaps big enough as not to annoy any neighbours Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damkia Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 Above all else when dealing with neighbours, don't forget to stress the importance of your strip in the event of an emergency - ie getting goods in/out if you are cutoff by fire/floods. Welcome their request for assistance in things like post incident survey of their property, etc. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gnarly Gnu Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 I own a small 40 acre semi-rural property.I did all the research before putting the strip in and found The council have NO say. Totally agree, some good advice here. Always remember that in Australia councils are unconstitutional bodies who do not even have the legal right to charge rates, so you are doing them a favour paying and putting up with them when they really should be tarred and feathered and run out of town. Look after your neighbours not the council. 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rankamateur Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 [ATTACH=full]20818[/ATTACH] This was my strip before I moved to Boonah. Lots of fun but no room for error Is that a horse stud's stalls in the back ground? Good neighbours for a landing area? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XP503 Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 Hey Rank Yes it is actually, a very large international one! And they genuinely LOVED having my Drifter across the road, I took the stable hands for rides - they said the horses didn't bat an eyelid or care at all, same with the local farmers and pickers close by, they would always come up to me and say how cool it looked and how much fun I must be having..... The strip was just over 100 metres long but it runs up hill towards the hangar, one way in, one way out - no going around. I miss that place "Diggers Bridge" 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antdan Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Hi! I'm new on the forum but I wanted to mention this as it is relevant to the topic. (and I used to have a private pilots license with a dream of re-newing one day) My sister is selling her 100 acres (with modern home + extras) and only 2 hours (by car) from Sydney, 1 hour from Canberra and 25 minutes from Goulburn (NSW). It has the potential of an air strip with a flat pasture measuring 100M wide by 1.2KM length. Have a look if interested (listed today 3 Feb. 2015). http://www.realestate.com.au/property-acreage+semi+rural-nsw-windellama-118982739 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farri Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 I would also like to put a few old caravans on the property so people who may fly in, could stay overnight. It's been a dream of ours for some time. In my opinion, this is the one to be most concerned about! Liability!.... Can you get or afford, insurance cover, if so, how much cover is enough, if not, how much do you have to loose in the event of the worst case scenario, accident? My main query is, do you need council / local authority approval to make an airstrip on your own property ? I reckon this would depend on the local Council/Authority bylaws and the zoning of the land, I`d say! check the local bylaws and the land zoning without mentioning anything about your intentions until you are sure where you stand, legally. In his post above, Teckair, has given the best attitude to have with local neighbors but even if all the neighbors are on side, the problems can arise if a new neighbor, who hates these, "damn noisy aircraft", moves into the area....I have a few examples of neighbors who did everything they could to stop people from flying off their own property. Want to read any, just ask! Keeping the neighbors on side is what I`ve always done and will always continue to do and no one bothers me. Frank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happyflyer Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Just as the council has no way of stopping you driving to your home, it has no way of stopping you flying to your home. As long as you have the room to be safe. All CASA requires is that you have the permission of the land owner (you). Councils do not regulate aviation. The problems only start if there is commercial land use. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Isaac Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 CASA also requires compliance (and so does your insurer) with the dimensional requirements for your aeroplane laid out in the CASA requirements for 'Aeroplane Landing Areas' (ALAs). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 You can't guarantee your neighbours won't change. If they suck up to the Council, the Council will try to give you a hard time to please them. 'If you have a bit of a win they will just make life harder for you, as they often have little better to do. I would enquire about aerodromes where you live around the perimeter and directly access it, then all the insurance and advice needed is shared. You have more security etc also. Unless you live out in the sticks, where you do as you want. Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happyflyer Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 CASA also req If you are saying permission from CASA is required, do you have a reference for that? I have never heard of it and certainly none of my friends with strips have ever communicated with CASA. It is my belief CASA have zero interest in private use strips. There appears to be a lot of negativity to someone having a private strip. I know at least ten people with privates strips within 50 miles of me. None have had any problems that stopped them flying . What could be better than your own strip if you have the room? I would love to be in that situation. If you are in that situation - go for it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djpacro Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 If you are saying permission from CASA is required, do you have a reference for that? David and I like to live in the past. It is my belief CASA have zero interest in private use strips. Not true - their website is dead right now - refer their CAAP on the subject. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happyflyer Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 David and I like to live in the past.Not true - their website is dead right now - refer their CAAP on the subject. I have read the CAAP. It is very straight forward and just telling you what common sense would tell any intelligent person who was setting up a strip. This is the first sentence: IMPORTANT The information in this publication is advisory only. There is no legal requirement to observe the details set out in this publication. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now