Paint ?

[jackc]

 

Hermits don’t want to be seen 🙂. It’s called flying under the radar.   One day in future times we will need to be stealth flyers as we become a hunted species 🙂 

I am just getting in early!!!

[Bruce Tuncks]

Jackc, there was a famous guy ( Steve Whittman ) who died when the fabric came off his homebuilt due to some sort of incompatibility in the system.

I think the lesson here is to be careful and maybe do some long-term testing if you are pioneering.

[jackc]

IF the process is doable without any increase of risk in failure, I would do it. I asked Wingtech and they said it may be possible with more research.

Maybe I will go there just for the research aspect and see what I find…..

[onetrack]

Steve Wittmans fatal crash was caused by improper installation of the wing fabric. The fabric covering had not been installed according to the polyfibre covering and paint manual. The underlying plywood was not treated with the correct poly-brush compound.

The fabric on top of the wing separated from the underlying plywood, resulting in induced aileron-wing flutter. This flutter started with delamination of the fabric at the trailing edge of an unbonded section of the fabric at an aileron wing station.

 

https://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/35828

[JG3]

On 30/09/2021 at 9:06 AM, skippydiesel said:

No idea Jack - I would guess, it would be desirable to know that the solvents in the paint didn't "eat" the fabric (chemical compatibility) and that the paint used, had sufficient plasticisers to flex (rather than crack) with the fabric.

The good quality exterior water based house paintss work well on Dacron fabric. Stick well and are very flexible. Clean the fabric first with spraying thinners. Sounds vicious but doesnt hurt the Dacron at all. 

[jackc]

3 hours ago, JG3 said:

The good quality exterior water based house paintss work well on Dacron fabric. Stick well and are very flexible. Clean the fabric first with spraying thinners. Sounds vicious but doesnt hurt the Dacron at all. 

Thanks 🙂. Worth a shot, have a spare set of skins that came from the plane originally, need to check their integrity and can experiment with painting them and see what happens.

Not sure WHY they were originally taken off? 

[Keenaviator]

I used Stewart Systems water born 2 pack paint on my Jabiru. Watched all the videos and read all the Stewart Systems instructions. I made a temporary spray booth in my shed with filtered air extraction system and a heater to maintain the required temperature. I found one compressor insufficient for the HVLP gun and ended up running two in tandem. I liked the idea of using distilled water as a thinner rather than poisonous thinners. I'm definitely an amateur when it comes to painting but the results were pretty good.  Laurie

[JG3]

5 hours ago, jackc said:

Thanks 🙂. Worth a shot, have a spare set of skins that came from the plane originally, need to check their integrity and can experiment with painting them and see what happens.

Not sure WHY they were originally taken off? 

I used Solaguard on old perished skins and the result was really good. Looked like new and now protected somewhat from UV.

[Blueadventures]

6 hours ago, jackc said:

Thanks 🙂. Worth a shot, have a spare set of skins that came from the plane originally, need to check their integrity and can experiment with painting them and see what happens.

Not sure WHY they were originally taken off? 

Hi Jack I just called Ben the owner before Ray. The skins you have were the ones before the new ones he fitted and you will find they are cut up as he used them for wing covers. Not serviceable. Cheers.

[skippydiesel]

4 hours ago, Keenaviator said:

I used Stewart Systems water born 2 pack paint on my Jabiru. Watched all the videos and read all the Stewart Systems instructions. I made a temporary spray booth in my shed with filtered air extraction system and a heater to maintain the required temperature. I found one compressor insufficient for the HVLP gun and ended up running two in tandem. I liked the idea of using distilled water as a thinner rather than poisonous thinners. I'm definitely an amateur when it comes to painting but the results were pretty good.  Laurie

Me too.

 

Like you I made a temporary spray booth, insulated with bubble wrap - heated with an old $40 (from Gum tree) window rattler - worked a treat.

 

To get a reliable air supply, a spent the big bucks and purchased a Honda power Pilot Air K25PR compressor. Passed the air  through a pressure regulator/water trap, then toilet role dryer and then a small inline water trap close to the gun. Had to make the compressor mobile, so built a two wheeled sub frame & handles, to wheel it around like a wheel barrow.

 

Like you, I followed the Stewart System "bible" and the result was just beyond my wildest expectations.

[jackc]

3 hours ago, Blueadventures said:

Hi Jack I just called Ben the owner before Ray. The skins you have were the ones before the new ones he fitted and you will find they are cut up as he used them for wing covers. Not serviceable. Cheers.

Thanks for that:-). They are all in boxes that came with the plane, never pulled them out to look.  That makes them handy anyway.  Was looking to get a new set from Wingtech before they cease manufacture?

 

[eightyknots]

On 29/09/2021 at 11:38 PM, jackc said:

Now for another crazy off the planet paint idea 🙂. My Thruster came with a spare set of skins,  I need to somehow get them tested to see IF they are serviceable.  IF they are OK I was going to try and ‘paint’ them with this paint scheme.

So, any ideas IF this would be doable?

 

Jack, I am a bit worried about flying over terrain, with your aircraft painted like this, and then not being seen by other other pilots.

[eightyknots]

On 05/10/2021 at 7:57 PM, JG3 said:

I used Solaguard on old perished skins and the result was really good. Looked like new and now protected somewhat from UV.

I wonder how good Solagard would be on metal skins (eg a Savannah)?

[Marty_d]

I would assume Solarguard would be fairly heavy - houses not generally having to worry about weight.

[Bruce Tuncks]

I'm impressed that you guys have been happy with the water 2 pack stuff. There was a guy at Gawler who painted his Pulsar with something like that and the result looked awful. Mind you, it was thought that he was going to die on his first flight in that plane, with all his previous experience being in slow high-drag stuff.

He has long since retired from flying, so I can't get more details...  It may well have been a different and earlier product.

[skippydiesel]

25 minutes ago, Bruce Tuncks said:

I'm impressed that you guys have been happy with the water 2 pack stuff. There was a guy at Gawler who painted his Pulsar with something like that and the result looked awful. Mind you, it was thought that he was going to die on his first flight in that plane, with all his previous experience being in slow high-drag stuff.

He has long since retired from flying, so I can't get more details...  It may well have been a different and earlier product.

Hi Bruce: I would speculate;

 

Paint finish is often at the "discretion" of the painter, being a reflection of their skill and or adherence to the manufacturers preparation/application recommendations.

 

I have used the Stewart System (water born 2 pack) aircraft certified system, to very good effect. Being an almost total novice (have screwed up a number of automotive paint applications) I followed the Stewart application instructions to the letter (completely out of character) and was pleasantly surprised at how well it turned out.

[skippydiesel]

Interesting - most aircraft are painted, at least in part, so why is this not a hot topic, with suggestions/alternatives coming from all directions????

[spacesailor]

Fabric covering,  does it use a " dope " to shrink the fabric. . ( like model airplanes Used to be )

Or is that old school, with the new fabric just pulled tight.

spacesailor

[facthunter]

No the new stuff shrinks when you use a hot iron on it.  Butyrate dope was used on new Pipers in the late 50's. Earlier it is nitrocellulose dope on light canvas . You used it on RAG tissue for the models. Nev

[skippydiesel]

1 hour ago, spacesailor said:

Fabric covering,  does it use a " dope " to shrink the fabric. . ( like model airplanes Used to be )

Or is that old school, with the new fabric just pulled tight.

spacesailor

As Nev said - hot iron. I used the Stewart System - they required 3 increasing temperatures (cant remember what they were now). I had great difficulty finding a domestic iron that would chive & hold a consistent temperature. In the end I purchased the largest model aeroplane iron, with a digital read out, that seemed to do the job. I glued the fabric on as tight as I could, then did the 3 passes of the iron consistent speed/pattern/application is important. You end up with a drum tight "skin" - very satisfying.

Edited October 19, 2021 by skippydiesel

[facthunter]

A fabric covered plane makes a special noise when the fabric is tight. Saggy fabric destroys lift.  I think that's why some older thrusters fly like they don't want to. Nev

[jackc]

It’s a wonder the old Skycraft Scout even got off the ground with its flappy fabric

🙂 

[JG3]

Just finished some painting with Protek Polyurethane 4:1.

Excellent results and easy to spray, good finish.

Costs $160 - $200 for 5 litre kit of paint and hardener depending upon colour.

[skippydiesel]

59 minutes ago, JG3 said:

Just finished some painting with Protek Polyurethane 4:1.

Excellent results and easy to spray, good finish.

Costs $160 - $200 for 5 litre kit of paint and hardener depending upon colour.

Great! At last someone responds with real/recent experience. Thank JG3.

 

Any chance of some photos?

 

Why did you choose this particular paint? 

 

What are you painting on to metal/composite/fabric/wood ?

 

If composite bits - did you use UV resistant undercoat ?

 

Oh! & I could do with some idea of your your methodology: ie spray gun type & nozzle, pressure settings, number of coats, temperature, mix by weight or volume, etc

Edited October 31, 2021 by skippydiesel

[Geoff_H]

On 30/09/2021 at 4:16 PM, Bruce Tuncks said:

Jackc, there was a famous guy ( Steve Whittman ) who died when the fabric came off his homebuilt due to some sort of incompatibility in the system.

I think the lesson here is to be careful and maybe do some long-term testing if you are pioneering.

What happened was that he glued the fabric to the timber.  Unfortunately most of the glue soaked into the timber leaving a very small amount of glue holding the fabric.  The fabric parted from the timber and all aerodynamic shape was lost.  I now paint any timber with epoxy, let that cure, sand timber back to smooth then glue attachment to the timber.