frank marriott Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 I hope everyone has submitted their vote (for those not attending). Plenty of debate on both sides but whether your opinion is YES or NO at least vote one way or the other as the outcome for our association is considerable. The more that vote gives the outcome more credibility. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
storchy neil Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 hey frank what the betting price on total number of votes to be counted less than 5000 so that will mean that 5000 don't give a xxxxxxxx neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frank marriott Posted May 9, 2016 Author Share Posted May 9, 2016 No idea Neil, but too late to complain about the result if it doesn't go the way they want - can only ask everyone to indicate their opinion. I suspect you will be on the money, so no I'm not betting. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Camel Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 I believe this is more a case of true lack of understanding of the full content as I'm the first to admit I do not understand the full implications of either side ! I think for me it will be who do I trust ! 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonRamsay Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 If you can't be in Canberra on Saturday, you can give your open proxy to somebody you trust that you know has worked their way through the voluminous, complex and to the average pilot/maintainer, boring Acts of Parliament and constitutions and formed a considered view. That is a responsible exercise of your democratic right and responsibility to cast a vote. However, giving your proxy to somebody who has not done the work and has just got a "gut feeling", is not, to my way of thinking, a responsible use of your vote. 3 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 Don, please stop leading members up the garden path. A member can give their proxy to another member for either a Yes or No vote. It doesn't matter what their proxy member votes for, i.e. I can vote NO and give my proxy to someone who is voting Yes, my vote is still counted as a NO and their vote is still counted as a Yes. However, giving your proxy to somebody who has not done the work and has just got a "gut feeling", is not, to my way of thinking, a responsible use of your vote. Is a load of rubbish and pure one sided scare tactics that belittles RAAus members inferring they can't think for themselves 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightmare Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 Hehehe, I'm a new pilot and don't know anyone I can proxy through.... ah well, I guess I won't be voting, I might go flying instead.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Crezzi Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 Hehehe, I'm a new pilot and don't know anyone I can proxy through.... ah well, I guess I won't be voting, I might go flying instead.... You can, & should, appoint the chairman to be your proxy using this form https://www.vision6.com.au/ch/48209/2w9xk/2133309/6c12094ct.html Cheers John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 Hehehe, I'm a new pilot and don't know anyone I can proxy through.... ah well, I guess I won't be voting, I might go flying instead.... You can print off the proxy form, fill it in, scan it and email it to RAA. You can nominate the chairman as your proxy and indicate how you want them to vote. Takes 5 minutes. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kgwilson Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 Normally you can either direct your proxy to vote one way or the other, or you can direct your proxy to vote as the proxy feels fit at the meeting. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gandalph Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 The editorialising is beginning to make the Murdoch press seem reasonable and unbiased 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
storchy neil Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 Hehehe, I'm a new pilot and don't know anyone I can proxy through.... ah well, I guess I won't be voting, I might go flying instead nightmare I am not having a go at you personal as I think that is a wined up but when we as an organization lose every thing that we have fought for through apathy and not been diligent in the way that the organization should be run when you lose an what you had through idiots abuseing their power and asumeing they know whats best your vote may have let you continue flying neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonRamsay Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 Don, please stop leading members up the garden path. A member can give their proxy to another member for either a Yes or No vote. It doesn't matter what their proxy member votes for, i.e. I can vote NO and give my proxy to someone who is voting Yes, my vote is still counted as a NO and their vote is still counted as a Yes. Ian, Good to see you back on deck and trust you had an enjoyable weekend pampering mothers. I have no argument with what you can do with your proxy. I wasn't disputing that and I'm not clear how you got to that understanding. Possibly it has to do with a directed proxy versus an open one? I could have made that clearer. I was urging members to use their proxy vote responsibly by making sure that if they give an open proxy to somebody who has done the research and formed a considered view then that is a good thing to do. To give your open proxy to somebody who has not canvassed the issues thoroughly would be, in my personal view, irresponsible. Is a load of rubbish and pure one sided scare tactics As you know, I post on here as an individual, not as a Board Member and have made it crystal clear what I think is best for the future of RAAus. All the contrary arguments I have seen carry no weight for me, personally, especially when measured against the benefits of the reforms. And anyone who was scared by my post needs to see a shrink and/or take a teaspoon of cement and harden up - especially if they want to run the gauntlet here. . . . that belittles RAAus members inferring they can't think for themselves On the contrary, I was asking members to use their proxy wisely and responsibly and to not just give it away to the first person who asks for it. Don 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kasper Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 Ian,Good to see you back on deck and trust you had an enjoyable weekend pampering mothers. I have no argument with what you can do with your proxy. I wasn't disputing that and I'm not clear how you got to that understanding. Possibly it has to do with a directed proxy versus an open one? I could have made that clearer. I was urging members to use their proxy vote responsibly by making sure that if they give an open proxy to somebody who has done the research and formed a considered view then that is a good thing to do. To give your open proxy to somebody who has not canvassed the issues thoroughly would be, in my personal view, irresponsible. As you know, I post on here as an individual, not as a Board Member and have made it crystal clear what I think is best for the future of RAAus. All the contrary arguments I have seen carry no weight for me, personally, especially when measured against the benefits of the reforms. And anyone who was scared by my post needs to see a shrink and/or take a teaspoon of cement and harden up - especially if they want to run the gauntlet here. On the contrary, I was asking members to use their proxy wisely and responsibly and to not just give it away to the first person who asks for it. Don Given the proxy forms provided for members from the RAAus for this vote are ALL drafted as specific directions its reasonable to not think of open proxies https://www.raa.asn.au/our-organisation/our-constitution/draft-constitution/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
storchy neil Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 questions ? can you land a GA aircraft any where that is not an ALA ? can you land a raa registered aircraft any where as long as it safe to do so ? neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonRamsay Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 Given the proxy forms provided for members from the RAAus for this vote are ALL drafted as specific directions its reasonable to not think of open proxieshttps://www.raa.asn.au/our-organisation/our-constitution/draft-constitution/ To leave it up to your proxy to choose all you have to do is leave the form without ticks in either box. I agree a third box would have made this clearer. Don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tillmanr Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 On the proxy form there is no indication as to a tick or a cross being required. Can you clarify which is needed or is mandatory. Will the vote be considered for the blank box if I use a cross? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff13 Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 If you can't be in Canberra on Saturday, you can give your open proxy to somebody you trust that you know has worked their way through the voluminous, complex and to the average pilot/maintainer, boring Acts of Parliament and constitutions and formed a considered view. That is a responsible exercise of your democratic right and responsibility to cast a vote.However, giving your proxy to somebody who has not done the work and has just got a "gut feeling", is not, to my way of thinking, a responsible use of your vote. I must admit that when I read this I went scrambling for the books to see how the proxies were meant to work. It did leave me in some doubt but a few minutes in the books soon cleared it up. The editorialising is beginning to make the Murdoch press seem reasonable and unbiased I didn't think this was funny even though it did get a couple of funnies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 questions ?can you land a GA aircraft any where that is not an ALA ? can you land a raa registered aircraft any where as long as it safe to do so ? neil An ALA is defined as: Aircraft Landing Area for the purpose of CAR92 (1)(d) Here's CAR 92 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 My interpretation of those regs is that you can land in a field suitable for the purpose, but if it all goes tits up CASA might impose a hefty fine. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightmare Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 Hehehe, I'm a new pilot and don't know anyone I can proxy through.... ah well, I guess I won't be voting, I might go flying insteadnightmare I am not having a go at you personal as I think that is a wined up but when we as an organization lose every thing that we have fought for through apathy and not been diligent in the way that the organization should be run when you lose an what you had through idiots abuseing their power and asumeing they know whats best your vote may have let you continue flying neil So what are you/we losing, Neil? Tony 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonRamsay Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 On the proxy form there is no indication as to a tick or a cross being required. Can you clarify which is needed or is mandatory. Will the vote be considered for the blank box if I use a cross? All that is required is to clearly indicate your preference which is the same for the rules of the Australian Electoral Commission. Personally, I'd "tick" but I've seen crosses and other ways of indicating your preference. If you are in favour, make sure you email it in to [email protected] . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gandalph Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 I didn't think this was funny even though it did get a couple of funnies. I didn't think it was funny either Geoff, that's what prompted the post. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 My interpretation of those refs is that you can land in a field suitable for the purpose, but if it all goes tits up CASA might impose a hefty fine. And you will have no defence to negligence if you injure someone because the field was shorter, bumpier than you thought etc. In my training what happened was that the CFI laid down his requirements which meant you had to visit the paddock, measure it and be able to drive a car along the strip at 100 km/hr etc., check and measure the obstacles. What you finish up with is a landing area with the normal safety margins. So is something does go wrong (other than with the landing area itself, you have that evidence to defend yourself against any accusation that the landing area was unsafe. Of course that rules out short cuts like landing on a beach on a whim, dropping in to an airfield without phoning ahead to check and so on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aldo Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 Pretty easy really, if you stuff it up the oil light came on (precautionary), if you don't stuff it up keep using it until the oil light comes on!! Probably now comes under the thread drift rules Aldo 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now