Loss of control surface

[Admin]

You are flying along quite happy and suddenly you lose a control surface. Which one do you think would be the worst to lose and why

 

1. Ailerons

 

2. Rudder

 

3. Elevator

 

 

[Yenn]

All of the above, but probably rudder. All dependent on the design of plane.

 

 

[Keenaviator]

Rudder.

 

If you lose ailerons your secondary effect of the rudder is roll.

 

If you lose elevator you could use power to adjust attitude or trim.

 

 

[forexjohnny]

Well I do not have any of those so I guess I would circle the area and look for where you crashed!!!! :)

 

 

[SDQDI]

You fellas obviously haven't flown with a nose wheel pilot, some I have seen are quite capable of flying all stages of flight without a rudder!

 

Elevator would be my pick, although it depends on what you mean "lose" as if it is a broken control you can still fly quite happily with trim but if it is a jammed control then you are stuck with relying on power and it certainly isn't foolproof whereas losing/jamming either rudder or aileron isn't a biggie (unless of course they get jammed at full deflection) and you should still be able to fly and land quite safely.

 

 

[red750]

Do you mean like this?

 

 

 

[robinsm]

Came across an sapphire aircraft a couple of years ago where the pilot found, on landing, that the covering for his elevator had disappeared. The cloth had departed the aircraft and the pilot did not notice much difference in the handling. True story, makes you think.

 

I think the loss of the rudder would present a real problem...no fine directional control, could make landings and take offs interesting...lol

 

 

[planedriver]

Having flown a lot of R/C aircraft in the early days which had rudder control only, I would opt for the rudder, but wouldn't be totally happy till I was on the ground in one piece. It would also depend a bit on the type of terrain around you, and what you were flying.

 

 

[bexrbetter]

Do you mean like this?

Probably the best scenario, control surface gone rather than interfering with control and has redundancy.

 

 

[M61A1]

I have seen an ag pilot land with his rudder trailing behind only attached by the cables. I think no rudder would be the easiest to deal with. I have flown approaches with hands completely off the stick, using only power and rudder. While the landing are a little untidy, they are very survivable.

 

 

[Nico13]

I think elevator would be the worst to lose physically because that would take your trim with it and trying to control a round out and flair on power alone, well lets just say you don't get it right the most likely outcome would be a bounced landing so things would get very sticky very quickly.

 

If you still had trim then it's a different ball game, much more survivable.

 

Rudder if it's a tail dragger wouldn't be too good for a controlled landing either.

 

A low wing with very little to no dihedral it would be ailerons that would give you biggest heart ache as rudder would have little effect on roll.

 

Overall I think elevator on any configuration would be my biggest concern.

 

 

[dutchroll]

Rudder? Crikey. In my day job the rudder pedals are merely footrests (except for takeoff and engine failure)! I'm admittedly guilty of not using it enough on my fun-plane too.

 

When I was in the RAAF I did some experiments in the C130 full flight simulator and total loss of elevator control (including elevator trim) resulted in the most difficulty retaining control of the aircraft. However with some deft use of power and a bit of forethought, the aircraft could still be landed by an experienced and well-trained pilot with any one control surface unusable. Unusable control surfaces in more than one axis required some fairly fancy flying due to phugoid oscillations coupled with rolling or yawing, and depending on the circumstances does not always end well.

 

 

[IBob]

As a low hour recreational pilot, I would think loss of elevator would be most challenging.

 

Rudder I can see doing without, once in the air: lots of us start that way anyway!

 

Without ailerons, the aircraft would hopefully stay right side up, except in sever turbulence, and ugly small turns could still be done with rudder. This would allow the pilot time to fly around while thinking through his options.

 

In practice, it's hard to imagine losing elevator control and the aircraft remaining well enough trimmed to allow time to work it all out?

 

 

[Jaba-who]

Do you mean like this?[ATTACH=full]49291[/ATTACH]

I saw this guy doing this act in Oshkosh and he lost progressively more and more bits. Unfortunately I can't remember which bits but it was quite a lot.

 

 

[facthunter]

it's not really a debate. The elevator IS the critical control unless you have some way of changing the Cof G as Santos Dumont had on his sausage shaped balloon. Any "proper" plane has backup on the pitch control and in my view it should be design mandated on any 3 axis aircraft. Fully independent trim system (not spring onto control run) would do but can still require some luck and good technique to land it well. The other controls are available as further effect of another still available one. Nev

 

 

[Yenn]

What was meant in the question by "lose"?

 

Loose the use of means trim would work the elevator, so no really big problem.

 

Definitely elevator loss would be bad in a glider.

 

If you had a stuck, or trimmable elevator, the rudder would be necessary.

 

 

[Jayke]

This would of been an interesting flight.

 

I bet you his a$@e would have been puckered.

 

 

 

[Geoff13]

Just goes to show anything will fly if you give it enough power.

 

 

[Akromaster]

There was a video posted a little while ago where a training c152 had a jammed elevator. The instructor took control and managed to land safely.

 

 

I used to play an online flight sim (best flight model that I know of) that simulates control surfaces being shot off. Occasionally you could lose all control surfaces which I've never recovered from but quite frequently I could coax the plane back and land with just rudder and elevator or even sometimes with just rudder - much harder of course and quite often ended in a crash.

 

Ak

 

 

[Vlad]

Some years ago an experimental in Brazil slashed his vertical stab and rudder by wires. Flew it home for 10 min or so and managed to land.

 

Could find pictures I have them somewhere in my archives.

 

 

[Guernsey]

Definitely the Elevators as they would be the most expensive to replace and I don't have much money.

 

Alan.

 

 

[Bruce Tuncks]

My Mosquito glider was quite flyable without rudder and elevator. The ailerons and flaps could control the direction and speed.

 

OR you could control it ok with no ailerons and flaps just using the rudder and elevator.

 

There was plane built with no elevator, the wing rotated to give the same effect.

 

You could fly my Jabiru with no elevator, just the trim would work ok. I have no intention of demonstrating this.

 

 

[facthunter]

The trim is not separate on your jabiru, nor is it on a tiger moth. it's a spring applying a force to the ONLY mechanical linkage on the plane. There is no pitch control redundancy. Nev

 

 

[johnm]

I could put informative FH but its a good cautionary message you convey .... particularly for the numerous Jabiru ...... so i gave your message a caution

 

 

[Bruce Tuncks]

Yes Nev, you are right in that the trim goes to the same horn as the elevator cable. It would depend on just where the failure was ... if the horn parted from the elevator, you sure would lose both.

 

I would still reckon you could put it down , with no flare out but not much worse than some landings I have seen.

 

Please dont ask for a demo.