Fine in theory but will it work

[Bruce Tuncks]

The reason why the US got involved in Afghanistan was because the country to the north was thought to be the next Saudi of oil.

 

If you look at a map you will see that they needed a compliant regime in Afghanistan to run a pipeline to the sea and thence to the US.

 

Well they were wrong, but there is gas there and this is going to China by way of that pipeline.

 

 

[Mike Borgelt]

"Problem is a number of countries are mandating and going straight to full EV by 2050"

 

Oh good. They had better amend the Laws of Physics while they are at it. Politicians seem to think they can do this.

 

As for "Australians have no idea about depletion", you can leave off the last two words, Bruce.

 

 

[boleropilot]

I nearly got skittled in Cambodia because I was stupid enough (a policeman's description of me) when I stepped out onto a pedestrian crossing when traffic was approaching

 

When I managed to get to the other side (only just - about 3 of them tried to get me - I think one actually changed lanes to have a better chance) I saw a police car approaching

 

I flagged him down and asked "what the duck are these white lines and signs for" and he replied that the road is for cars and if I was going to be stupid HE would run me over

 

gotta love Cambodia, lovely place to visit, but - sorry, no it's not...interesting, but damn scary - they don't need pedestrian bridges, you could walk across any creek or river on the floating garbage...

 

as for the airport at Siem Reap - my God what a goatrope - slovenly dressed 'customs officials" taking all the passports to check them - 100 people waiting to get them back - one officer holding up passports at the photo page and calling out "who this"

 

when the passport owner (at the back of the crowd) calls out ME, the 'officer' flicks the passport at him over the head of the crowd - he picks it up, calls out "John Brown' and some bloke in the middle of the scrum says "that's me"

 

I kid you not - when there's no oil left this mob will just go back to little carts behind buffalos - and they will get by just fine, thank you.....

 

 

[facthunter]

A good reason to travel is so you appreciate HERE... But be quick. HERE won't last forever. Nev

 

 

[onetrack]

A lot of people either seem to have forgotten that a Mr Ferdinand Porsche had a moderately successful hybrid electric car in 1899 - and one William Morrison of Des Moines (who was actually Scottish) produced a successful electric-powered horseless buggy in 1890 - which vehicle was Americas first successful, powered, road vehicle (excluding electric trolleys and tramcars, of course).

 

Not many know either, that Henry Ford owned and utilised a Detroit electric car, while he was building his first IC-engine powered car!

 

https://ir.uiowa.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=7666&context=annals-of-iowa

 

The Baker (Electric) Motor Vehicle Co was very successful in the early 1900's and a lot of American road vehicles were electric in that era.

 

History of Electric Cars

 

It was a combination of bad press and corporate scams surrounding electric motive power, that assisted in the demise of that form of power before WW1.

 

The "lead cab bubble" was a huge stock scam that led many to believe that the entire concept of electric motive power was suspect.

 

The Baker Torpedo electric car crashed at over 100mph in 1902 and killed two spectators. More bad press for electrics.

 

The great tech bubble ... of the 1900s

 

Walter Baker and His Remarkable Electric Racing Cars | The Old Motor

 

The design and introduction of electric starters, plus the lure of vastly-increased range offered by petrol-power, were the two major features that eventually killed the electric car.

 

The lure of instant go, with no delay, and a range limited only by where you could acquire petrol, were seductive winners for IC engines.

 

But no-one foresaw the problems of huge pollution once the numbers of IC-engined cars in the world reached astronomical numbers.

 

If Chinese car ownership was at American levels of car ownership, the world pollution levels would be highly visible.

 

We have little choice but to redouble our efforts to produce long-range electric motive power as a replacement for IC engines.

 

To that end, I believe the Chinese will lead the way. There's one thing the Chinese are good at, and it is electrical-based products.

 

Li Peng and the CCP have stated that their aim is to turn China into a leading electric motive power society, and I believe they will achieve that aim by about 2030.

 

CATL aims to plug into the global market - Business - Chinadaily.com.cn

 

 

[Mike Borgelt]

Well, the Chinese had better figure out how to completely re-cycle the batteries. This is done with the lead acid SLI batteries, quite well. IC auto pollution is only a problem in large metro areas. Over most of Australia it is inconsequential.

 

The problem is the idiots in government will want a 100% solution where reducing the number of IC cars in cities to 10% of the present number will do fine.

 

 

[M61A1]

and he replied that the road is for cars and if I was going to be stupid HE would run me over

That's almost enough to make me want to move there. Do you think we could ever re-educate our cops and Transport Dept to that line of thinking?

[Deskpilot]

OK, back to the beginning. In my opening post I mentioned an engine I was theorizing about and I think I have enough modeled now to put my idea forward.

 

The basic idea is to minimize part count and weight. To this end, I've thrown out the crankcase, oil pump, filter and oil, plus valve push rods and rocker arms.. WHAT!

 

Let's start with a Balandin cross beam set-up and fit it with modern high speed, high temperature and sealed bearings.

 

There are several ways to make this work:

 

 

GrabCAD - CAD library

 

My version,

 

 

Mount it in a light ally space frame. I've left out center guides and end bearings for clarity.

 

 

Add cylinders, note lengthened rear fin areas for better cooling.

 

 

Now, this is where it gets interesting. Ever heard of the 'T' head design. Not used since way back when. It presents a pure cross-flow head and with the use of electronic 'sluice valves', presents no hindrance to gas flow what so ever.

 

So how does it work. Pretty clear really. An electronic timing system on the main shaft, controls the opening and shutting of the valves at the correct time. By manipulating the input pulses, the valves can be made to

 

operate extremely fast without over heating. I'll draw wave forms if you want it. As all components are open the the air-stream, cooling becomes a minor problem.

 

Of coarse, the valves have to have close tolerances and guides to ensure correct operation. As the engine fires, the valve plate would be pressed hard against it's outside face and help seal it.

 

Ignition could be a simple magneto or an alternator and distributor but in a different configuration.

 

[ATTACH]54147[/ATTACH]

 

So there you have it. Ram air induction with A TWO STROKE MIX for upper cylinder lubrication.

 

Now, remember this is theoretical only, nothing is to scale and support plates have been omitted for clarity. The the question is, Fine in theory but will it work?

 

 

 

 

[onetrack]

I'm sorry, Doug, I fail to see how the Balandin cross-beam system transfers its reciprocating motion to a rotary motion in the crankshaft. Does it use gear teeth on the crankshaft cranks?

 

The CAD drawing in the YouTube video is clumsily and badly drawn, and seriously lacking in fine engineering detail.

 

Is this the principle in the design?

 

 

Your cross-beam engine would benefit from dual combustion chambers top and bottom of the piston, resulting in a vast improvement in balance in operation, as well as power.

 

You are then only left with a sealing problem on the conrods for the lower combustion chamber.

 

I understand Balandin used this principle in an engine he designed in the early 1950's.

 

The important aim in engine efficiency is the utilisation of as much of the waste engine heat into power. To this end, the Elsbett Diesel Engine with the Elsbett Duothermic Combustion system appears to be a winner.

 

The Elsbett Combustion System was so effective at heat transfer minimisation, it dispensed with water and air cooling and only used oil as the engine cooling medium.

 

However, it appears development of the Elsbett engine has stalled, and nothing has come of it for over 10 years. Elsbett apparently went off on a tangent with vegetable oil conversions - which now, also seem to have stalled.

 

My favourite revised engine design is this one (link below) - but development seems to also have stalled on it. They have produced some engines commercially for trikes, but apparently, no major manufacturer has shown any serious interest in it.

 

The trilobate crankshaft design lends itself to very high torque at low RPM and is ideal for aircraft use. The designer has moved engineering development to Turkey, and I don't think that has achieved anything.

 

Power& Torque (Revetec engines)

 

 

[bexrbetter]

Bex said: "Problem is a number of countries are mandating and going straight to full EV by 2050"Oh good. They had better amend the Laws of Physics while they are at it. Politicians seem to think they can do this.

.

I have no idea what that means.

 

Yes - the fuel tax issue is there in the background, but it will be a gradual process and governments will just have to find other revenue sources to compensate.

It's going to be an interesting one, on one hand the Government is telling everyone they are saving the planet by killing IC cars, and on the other hand they will be considering taxing the saviors.

 

Can't see Australia getting involved with EV's via mass production for a very long time.

They may not have much choice, who's going to make the petrol cars when the main players are only making EVs in 30 years.

I know, we can buy a Holden or a Ford. Wait, what?

 

If Chinese car ownership was at American levels of car ownership, the world pollution levels would be highly visible.

? China isn't so far behind America now, nearly 200 million cars Vs the US at 250 million. All cars in China are minimum Euro 3 emissions, the bulk are Euro 4 and some Euro 5. The amount of 'dirty' cars in America must be quite large as the average car age is 12 years. Point is China is having a much smaller effect there than you might think at first.

 

 

[Bruce Tuncks]

I reckon our extreme immigration policy is ignoring the laws of physics as well as biology and common-sense.

 

How are they all going to be fed in 50 years?

 

Surely there should be a plan B which doesn't involve impossible things.

 

There are some people who think Star Wars is a peep into the future. Just count how many times the laws of physics are broken in that show.

 

 

[Guest Guest]

"Problem is a number of countries are mandating and going straight to full EV by 2050"Oh good. They had better amend the Laws of Physics while they are at it. Politicians seem to think they can do this.As for "Australians have no idea about depletion", you can leave off the last two words, Bruce.

So true. " Australia has no idea" in many areas starting with politics! Total joke! Innovation? Little to none. Infrastructure? Way behind the 8 ball!

 

 

[GyPySusi]

Here's a few observations from someone who has watched engine developments closely over many years:1): When the adjectives/adverbs in the commentary ( 'revolutionary', 'greatest', 'unmatched') etc. seem to outnumber the actual fact-bearing words used, ....

Oscar, fully agree. Where superlatives abound amidst a "sales pitch" beware !

I saw or do not remember any mention of lubrication.

 

The pistons themselves are not subject to side loading which is good. That is absorbed by the cylinder sleeves.

 

Methinks the Free Piston technology as posted by Arron 25 in Post #3 this thread has much more potential.

 

Reciprocal motion of the pistons is directly converted to electrical energy.

 

Electrical feed back would be available to aid in actual piston positioning when and as necessary, such as when starting or modifying the piston motion to increase thermal efficiency. The latter would require delicate balance between any potential thermal efficiency increase and electrical losses, but maybe achievable.

 

The Russell Engine would be subject to more friction, wear, and resultant hot spots, all of which may be minimised by adequate lubrication and design.

 

 

[onetrack]

China isn't so far behind America now, nearly 200 million cars Vs the US at 250 million.

Ahh, but you're talking total number of IC vehicles - I'm talking car ownership at per capita levels.The U.S. currently has an estimated 270M vehicles (IMO, a fairly low estimate. This figure covers only registered highway vehicles). The U.S. population stands at 323M. That's 0.835 vehicles per capita.China has 200M registered highway vehicles (as of March 2017). Chinas population is currrently an estimated 1,413,000,000. At a per capita vehicle density equal to the U.S., China would have 1,179,855,000 vehicles!

 

 

[turboplanner]

I reckon our extreme immigration policy is ignoring the laws of physics as well as biology and common-sense.How are they all going to be fed in 50 years?Surely there should be a plan B which doesn't involve impossible things.

 

There are some people who think Star Wars is a peep into the future. Just count how many times the laws of physics are broken in that show.

The population of Tokyo is in excess of 20 million people. They have one for the most efficient food supply systems and transport systems in the world.Run your figures on a population of 10 million in Adelaide; those numbers produce the taxes you need to support them.Time moves on, people change.

 

 

[M61A1]

The population of Tokyo is in excess of 20 million people. They have one for the most efficient food supply systems and transport systems in the world.Run your figures on a population of 10 million in Adelaide; those numbers produce the taxes you need to support them.Time moves on, people change.

Just because it can be done, doesn't mean we should.I think that you'll find Japan's immigration policy somewhat stricter than ours also. Why might that be?

 

 

[Bruce Tuncks]

Japan has a wonderful non-discriminatory immigration policy. Race and religion don't matter.

 

BUT you have to show that you can speak and write Japanese, and this would keep out riff-raff like me for sure.

 

The other thing they have is a law-abiding society, apparently there was only one murder for the whole country in 2015, the latest year for records to be available.

 

 

[facthunter]

You don't have to actually build a motor to know what efficiency it will have. It can be calculated to a pretty close figure.. Burning an organic substance (unless it's just hydrogen) will produce CO2 . High temp combustion also causes oxides of nitrogen. You can convert Hydrogen to electricity directly but it leaks and has to be highly compressed in a STRONG and heavy container.. Mainly just water comes out of the process.. We will invent more forms of storing energy, once it's worthwhile. (which is now).. Nev

 

 

[Deskpilot]

Onetrack, I agree, it's difficult to envisage. Took me ages but the I found this pictorial description. I hope it clarifies thing for you..Sorry for the orientation. Center section only oscillates, doesn't rotate.

 

 

 

[turboplanner]

Just because it can be done, doesn't mean we should.I think that you'll find Japan's immigration policy somewhat stricter than ours also. Why might that be?

It’s to keep the country racially pure.

[gareth lacey]

It’s to keep the country racially pure.

And so they should,seems they are not called racists for this policy but if we whiteys do the same thing we are racists

[nomadpete]

The Japanese avoid cultural clashes by having a single culture. The opposite to 'multiculture' which breeds dissent and encourages differences. It's easier to have harmony when we all sing from the same book.

 

 

[danny_galaga]

There are some people who think Star Wars is a peep into the future. Just count how many times the laws of physics are broken in that show.

Star Wars is set in the past ;-)

 

 

[spacesailor]

I notice on Most of these new inventive engines have a piston capped by a Head which absorbs heat but produces No power!

 

Just look at the Old Roots TS3 motor, 60 years of service & going strong in the Argentina's fishing fleet,

 

The Best power to weight of any diesel motor with great fuel economy.

 

spacesailor

 

 

[spacesailor]

NOW

 

Who is going to Design or produce My favorite engine with,

 

2 Nikosil cylinder's,

 

all aluminum Roots TStwo, (type,( TS3 wasTwoStroke3Cylinder))

 

AvgasOr 98 Mogas motor, for small aircraft, 50 or 75 hp would be great.

 

If an old Two pot banger (1/2 vw) can produce 35 to 40 hp with 1/2 the energy wasted on the head configuration, a Roots TS2 type, should easily produce a very high power to weight ratio, & still have only Two spark plugs, plus the same fuel consumption as the original two pot 11/2 VW.

 

spacesailor