turboplanner Posted December 5, 2019 Share Posted December 5, 2019 The usual stuff Fire ies handle. Trucks pumps tankers hoses.chainsaws I don't like the "Quote " function as it ends up out of context often. It referred to the posts just before mine. In the '83 fires near me the radio frequencies didn't match. These are avoidable stuff ups.. Nev The trucks are all relatively new now and the body designs are quite good albeit plenty of politics. Pumps are high volume, need to be able to do house fires and in Victoria they seem to use one truck as a pumper, but I’ve noticed up to two or three waiting to be filled at a 12 truck fire. One truck this year has called in trapped by a fire because they had no chainsaw. Maybe the idea is SES is called for clearing, but I’ve never seen an SES guy on TV using a chainsaw correctly yet. I think the radio frequencies came up in the Ash Wednesday Royal Commission. These days you could have a South Australian Crew driving a Queensland or Victorian truck or a New Zealand Crew doing the same, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SplitS Posted December 5, 2019 Share Posted December 5, 2019 The trucks are all relatively new now and the body designs are quite good albeit plenty of politics. Pumps are high volume, need to be able to do house fires and in Victoria they seem to use one truck as a pumper, but I’ve noticed up to two or three waiting to be filled at a 12 truck fire. One truck this year has called in trapped by a fire because they had no chainsaw. Maybe the idea is SES is called for clearing, but I’ve never seen an SES guy on TV using a chainsaw correctly yet. I think the radio frequencies came up in the Ash Wednesday Royal Commission. These days you could have a South Australian Crew driving a Queensland or Victorian truck or a New Zealand Crew doing the same, The trucks are not all new. I was doing a required proficiency course last night 2 of the 4 trucks where over 25 years old 1 truck was 10 plus and 1 truck was brand new. The older truck carried more water 3000L Brand new 1800L It had better crew protection, and also a lot more useless stuff that weighs it down. The older trucks do a better job because of their water carrying capacity. Most of the truck's carry quick fill pumps and we also have a quick fill trailer. Trucks are not wasted being used as pumpers. The chain saw issue is because of training and OH&S getting in the way. I have cut thousands of tonnes of fire wood (for sale) but don't have the "tickets" to use a CFA chain saw If I turn up in my private ute there is no problem go figure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted December 5, 2019 Share Posted December 5, 2019 The trucks are not all new. I was doing a required proficiency course last night 2 of the 4 trucks where over 25 years old 1 truck was 10 plus and 1 truck was brand new. The older truck carried more water 3000L Brand new 1800L It had better crew protection, and also a lot more useless stuff that weighs it down. The older trucks do a better job because of their water carrying capacity. Most of the truck's carry quick fill pumps and we also have a quick fill trailer. Trucks are not wasted being used as pumpers. The chain saw issue is because of training and OH&S getting in the way. I have cut thousands of tonnes of fire wood (for sale) but don't have the "tickets" to use a CFA chain saw If I turn up in my private ute there is no problem go figure. Whereabouts in Australia are you operating? I was talking about Victoria. Here we've worked ourselves out of the old Austins and Inters, and I think around a hundred are renewed every year. I get nervous when I realise that my trailer farm units carries 2/3 the capacity of the five tonners; I personally would prefer to see 3000, but there are other aspects 6.5 ot 7 tonne trucks have bigger wheels, so the whole working platform goes up introducing OHS issues, knee and ankle injury increase etc., but it could make a big difference on a hot windy day, when with the scenario I talked about, up to four trucks off the fire just filling. Do your trucks have chainsaws on board? In Melbourne a few years ago the predecessors of DELWP, who handle the Alpine Parks where they cloed off a lot of the 4WD tracks to "protect the environment" there was a policy introduced to only go in on the overgrown track behind a D3 dozer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest deanfi Posted December 5, 2019 Share Posted December 5, 2019 The 737 is dropping near us at the moment , very bad flying conditions with a strong westerly gusting to 35 knots , the Gosper mountain fire is moving very fast towards the central coast I guess there will be homes lost as it is just massive , I think we are ok just watching for any northerly wind component and we will leave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest deanfi Posted December 5, 2019 Share Posted December 5, 2019 DC10 dropping too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted December 5, 2019 Share Posted December 5, 2019 In Sandstone eucalypt country the fires only end when torrential rain comes, pretty much..Shame for the destruction which is happening and there's probably 2 months to go of extreme heat. Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NT5224 Posted December 5, 2019 Share Posted December 5, 2019 The 737 is dropping near us at the moment , very bad flying conditions with a strong westerly gusting to 35 knots , the Gosper mountain fire is moving very fast towards the central coast I guess there will be homes lost as it is just massive , I think we are ok just watching for any northerly wind component and we will leave. Best of luck with the fires deanfi... Stay safe and get out if you need to... We'll keep fingers crossed for you! Alan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mnewbery Posted December 5, 2019 Share Posted December 5, 2019 Coulson owned Lockheed water bomber seems to be a regular visitor to Canberra in November and December 2019. Bigger than the stumpy four and longer than a regular C-130. more orange too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skippydiesel Posted December 5, 2019 Share Posted December 5, 2019 The Green Wattle Creek fire has crossed Burragorang Lake - people have been air lifted out of the end of Ridge Road, Nattai, in the last few minutes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skippydiesel Posted December 5, 2019 Share Posted December 5, 2019 The Green Wattle Creek fire has reached New Jerusalem, Oakdale and crossed the Silverdale Road at Werombi - aircraft have all gone home, leaving the fire to the RFS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest deanfi Posted December 5, 2019 Share Posted December 5, 2019 Best of luck with the fires deanfi... Stay safe and get out if you need to... We'll keep fingers crossed for you! Alan We are ok thanks , fire came very close , was a stressful day , thankfully for us anyway is that the fire has now passed out property, as facthunter said the only way these fires will stop is with huge rainfall and that's not forecast anytime soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SplitS Posted December 5, 2019 Share Posted December 5, 2019 Whereabouts in Australia are you operating? I was talking about Victoria. Here we've worked ourselves out of the old Austins and Inters, and I think around a hundred are renewed every year. I get nervous when I realise that my trailer farm units carries 2/3 the capacity of the five tonners; I personally would prefer to see 3000, but there are other aspects 6.5 ot 7 tonne trucks have bigger wheels, so the whole working platform goes up introducing OHS issues, knee and ankle injury increase etc., but it could make a big difference on a hot windy day, when with the scenario I talked about, up to four trucks off the fire just filling. Do your trucks have chainsaws on board? In Melbourne a few years ago the predecessors of DELWP, who handle the Alpine Parks where they cloed off a lot of the 4WD tracks to "protect the environment" there was a policy introduced to only go in on the overgrown track behind a D3 dozer. Just north of the home of the Kelpie. Western Vic, Private vehicles are a very important resource. When a fire front is spotting over the trucks the private units can support and suppress the spotting. Around here private units make up over half the resources at most fires and they get zero recognition. Utes can get into places the trucks cannot. Harvested blue gum plantations are a good example the ruts are spaced wrong for the trucks they bottomed out. The utes on the other hand have a rough ride but they don't get stuck. OH&s on the newer taller trucks is an issue for sure especially with the age and fitness of most of the volunteers. They do have some nice features like electric hose winders, while they do add weight when blacking out they make life so much easier. None of the trucks carry chain saws they should but once again OH&s has infiltrated and infected everything. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted December 5, 2019 Share Posted December 5, 2019 Just north of the home of the Kelpie. Western Vic, Private vehicles are a very important resource. When a fire front is spotting over the trucks the private units can support and suppress the spotting. Around here private units make up over half the resources at most fires and they get zero recognition. Utes can get into places the trucks cannot. Harvested blue gum plantations are a good example the ruts are spaced wrong for the trucks they bottomed out. The utes on the other hand have a rough ride but they don't get stuck. OH&s on the newer taller trucks is an issue for sure especially with the age and fitness of most of the volunteers. They do have some nice features like electric hose winders, while they do add weight when blacking out they make life so much easier. None of the trucks carry chain saws they should but once again OH&s has infiltrated and infected everything. Know the area, I came from the South East so basically similar. In the Peri-Urban areas, farms are progressively subdvided, and the area is usually taken over by hobby farmers who don't see fire fighting as their responsibility. In our area I'm the only one with a fire fighting unit, and the CFA have made it clear they don't want me anywhere near them including spotting posts. What they do here is turn out the five tonne trucks and start running down the flanks of a grass fire, calling in more trucks when needed. So it might start with two trucks and finish with 20 trucks finally knocking down the fire . SA CFS used to have volunteer attack trucks, someting like a land cruiser with taknk and pump so the first two to the station could get to the fire fast. Blue gum plantations are a good example of where fire fighting equipment and strategies suddenly have to change. It seems to me that the 10 year logging originally planned is not taking place and they grow fast and big. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skippydiesel Posted December 5, 2019 Share Posted December 5, 2019 Today might be the big day for the Green Wattle Creek fire - now in amongst the hobby farms. Choppers already active. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fly_tornado Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 680 homes, that's going to send insurance premiums through the roof https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-12-06/properties-destroyed-total-fire-bans-in-place-as-nsw-burns/11772568 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 It certainly will and they spread it (extra cost) all over. People won't be able to insure in some places. Flood and Fire prone. In high crime areas you already pay more for contents. Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fly_tornado Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 1.9M hectares, just in NSW, this year. Barnaby better get on the blower and sort this out fairly soon. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/dec/03/revealed-monumental-nsw-bushfires-have-burnt-20-of-blue-mountains-world-heritage-area Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 1.9M hectares, just in NSW, this year. Barnaby better get on the blower and sort this out fairly soon. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/dec/03/revealed-monumental-nsw-bushfires-have-burnt-20-of-blue-mountains-world-heritage-area What's it got to do withy Barnaby? In any case some social media feral already told him he had to fix the Murray Darling Basin first. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butch Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 None of the trucks carry chain saws they should but once again OH&s has infiltrated and infected everything Splitz, both of our tankers, one heavy and one light carry chainsaws. You are supposed to have special course training to operate one. I had a professional faller and loggers licence until 10 years ago for DIPI. The brains at the CFA won't recognize it and wanted me to go to a course run by some snotty nosed instructor to show me what I have been doing safely for years (after passing a Government accepted licence). OH&S and the threat of someone suing are making it impossible for small brigades like us to attract new members. We all want to stay safe but as volunteers it's getting hard to keep current with all the courses and protocol enforced by the CFA. I think sometimes the paid members forget that the majority of fire fighters doing the ground work do it for free and in some cases lose income if you are self employed like I am. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Litespeed Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 Government need to get off the fence and realise the new regime of fire. We need the military to be available and respond like it is war. Other countries have no issue doing this. We can't just let fires start and not do everything possible as early as possible to stop the fire before it get way out of control. The Tassie fires were let go when early work could have made a big difference. Not just the military either. The gov needs to invest billions a year in machines and personnel. This is a national emergency that will only get worse. We are watching billions of land, farms, homes and millions of animals die. We need to treat fire like a enemy in war, it his no mercy and will not stop without rain and or massive human effort. If the use of military assets means they wear, good. At least they are been used, as are the personnel. RFS should be much better resourced and paid for their time, trained free and fully supported. We don't do pay free police or military volunteers, so why should fire fighters be used and abused because they want to help. All society needs the RFS so should pay. 1 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fly_tornado Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 What's it got to do withy Barnaby? In any case some social media feral already told him he had to fix the Murray Darling Basin first. barnaby will bark like a dog in front of the cameras Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 I had a professional faller and loggers licence until 10 years ago for DIPI. The brains at the CFA won't recognize it and wanted me to go to a course run by some snotty nosed instructor to show me what I have been doing safely for years (after passing a Government accepted licence). Sounds like it's just an ATO (Authority To Operate) certificate - plenty of training centres around Victoria OH&S and the threat of someone suing are making it impossible for small brigades like us to attract new members. Even the sausage sizzle volunteers outside Bunning have to do food handling courses. Just a matter of finding the nearest training facility, and either getting them to attend, or subsidising it with sausage sizzle money. We all want to stay safe but as volunteers it's getting hard to keep current with all the courses and protocol enforced by the CFA. I think sometimes the paid members forget that the majority of fire fighters doing the ground work do it for free and in some cases lose income if you are self employed like I am. Yes, reading the papers today I can see trouble coming with that; just remember that Victorians overwhelmingly support the volunteers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butch Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 Turbo, I have been in the CFA for 45 years....started with Austin trucks with no protection , just a tank and pump! I'm just sick of the bulltish ! Common sense these days doesn't come into the equation. You can't stop someone from being a dikchead! Some of the new breed of CFA members go off and do all of these courses and think they know it all. Nothing beats experience , and any brigade worth it's salt will mentor new members and not put them in a situation where they haven't got somebody with experience as part of a tanker crew going into a dangerous situation. The 4 deaths at Linton in Victoria years ago was attributed to that fact. No one on the unit had experience. I have flatly refused to enter a situation that I thought was unsafe as the driver of our Tanker. Experience has taught me that if you have a bad feeling and are not happy it's not worth risking the crews safety. Sadly the people with all the common sense and experience are leaving because they have had enough. I know this is progress and there has to be rules and regulations but if the general population aren't prepared to finance permanent fire fighters they will end up with no fire fighters at all! 3 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turboplanner Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 Turbo, I have been in the CFA for 45 years....started with Austin trucks with no protection , just a tank and pump! I'm just sick of the bulltish ! Common sense these days doesn't come into the equation. You can't stop someone from being a dikchead! Some of the new breed of CFA members go off and do all of these courses and think they know it all. Nothing beats experience , and any brigade worth it's salt will mentor new members and not put them in a situation where they haven't got somebody with experience as part of a tanker crew going into a dangerous situation. The 4 deaths at Linton in Victoria years ago was attributed to that fact. No one on the unit had experience. I have flatly refused to enter a situation that I thought was unsafe as the driver of our Tanker. Experience has taught me that if you have a bad feeling and are not happy it's not worth risking the crews safety. Sadly the people with all the common sense and experience are leaving because they have had enough. I know this is progress and there has to be rules and regulations but if the general population aren't prepared to finance permanent fire fighters they will end up with no fire fighters at all! I was about to say the Linton deaths have reshaped the situation in Victoria why they went there why they got trapped why they died. You'll notice a lot of people here also struggle with the legal liability changes, but its not going to go backwards. Personally I think fires are a lot more complicated than flying so we need the old guys. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onetrack Posted December 6, 2019 Share Posted December 6, 2019 Off subject a little - but this is just what the fireys don't need right now. There's some real low-life scum out there. With a bit of karma, their own home will be in the path of a fire, soon - and the fireys won't be able to help them, due to the missing equipment. https://www.criticalcomms.com.au/content/industry/news/equipment-stolen-from-rfs-radio-repeater-vehicle-338899293#axzz67HPpKaqg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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