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“I don't care who does the electing, as long as I get to do the nominating” William M Tweed You needn't look any further than that to find out why such duds as Trump become our political “leaders”.

Whatever he has lost it isn't credibility. He is right but there are too many idiots who are rusted on and think the Donald can do no wrong after 20,000 lies.

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Whatever he has lost it isn't credibility. He is right but there are too many idiots who are rusted on and think the Donald can do no wrong after 20,000 lies.

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Well, he's just set the scene to be scornfully declared a "fake pilot", hasn't he!  I gather he's picked up on the general feeling right through the U.S. Military - that they detest their CIC because they know he's actually the biggest fake President America has ever produced. Sully probably thinks its safe to now join a very large outspoken group of senior military people, who are thoroughly sick of DT, and who want a CIC with some demonstrable leadership abilities, and statesman-like skills.

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Trump want's his personal pilot to run the FAA and his family to run everything else.. It's essential to be qualified for the job, not just appointed or fired on a whim.Or be called suckers and losers. Just get "some" doctor to say your foot hurts and you can avoid "serving" your Country. Nev

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Trump tax returns. "Fake news" obtained by "illegal methods."

 

Paid $750 in income tax one year, $0 tax for 10 out of the last 15 years.

 

Claimed $70,000 for "hair styling" while on The Apprentice".

 

How does he get away with this?

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8 hours ago, Student Pilot said:

Has he lost credibility now he's shaved his mustache off? 

 

Hey SP, I recall seeing pics of y'self sporting a moe snapped when you were soaring into the seventies.

 

(You know, the era of Dennis Lillee et al.)  

 

As I recall, the effect was very similar to this:

 

1273696460_SPlookalike.thumb.png.2030dc9219cacf07adfabc5f9de23285.png

 

So, in answer to your question ... nah, maybe not.    😉

 

 

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Leadership as defined by a proven leader. If I was a Yank I would do as he suggests, but unfortunately I don't have to.

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The Lincoln project was formed by Republicans who hate trump. Sure Trump sucks. My big concern is that both sides of US politics have lost their way. The Dems selected Joe Biden who has age-related cognitive decline as far as I can tell (i.e. early dementia), and they failed to condemn the looting and destruction that took place with the BLM protests. Both moves were insane.

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RE: How and Donald:

 

With 380 million people in the United States, of which 240,000,000 are eligible to run, why have these two candidates been selected to run for the presidency?

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Sully is a pilot, Bette is a singer and actress skilled at repeating a script.

If you want to know what's going on best look carefully at the magicians not their flash  cards.

That includes the end game of both parties which have been hinted at, but not confirmed.

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1 hour ago, eightyknots said:

RE: How and Donald:

 

With 380 million people in the United States, of which 240,000,000 are eligible to run, why have these two candidates been selected to run for the presidency?

One potential weakness in any governance system is how it goes about choosing it's leadership candidates.
The practical reality we have at present, even in a very simple systems like NZ, is that candidates must embrace and a pursue a career as politicians in order to be nominated. This effectively screens or filters out almost of the populace, leaving us with a very small pool of individuals.

 

While I don't pretend to have a clear understanding of the US electoral system, I would suggest that the screening there is far more demanding in various ways, with large amounts of money further complicating the process.

And the results of the screening are what you would expect: individuals who fitted through the screens in various ways, who successfully exhibited certain political behaviours and ambitions over a period of time.

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31 minutes ago, IBob said:

One potential weakness in any governance system is how it goes about choosing it's leadership candidates.
The practical reality we have at present, even in a very simple systems like NZ, is that candidates must embrace and a pursue a career as politicians in order to be nominated. This effectively screens or filters out almost of the populace, leaving us with a very small pool of individuals.

 

While I don't pretend to have a clear understanding of the US electoral system, I would suggest that the screening there is far more demanding in various ways, with large amounts of money further complicating the process.

And the results of the screening are what you would expect: individuals who fitted through the screens in various ways, who successfully exhibited certain political behaviours and ambitions over a period of time.

Good points; it's worth a study of how just a handful of Chicago votes organised by Joe Kennedy got his son into the White House, and what happened when he didn't deliver.

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9 minutes ago, turboplanner said:

Good points; it's worth a study of how just a handful of Chicago votes organised by Joe Kennedy got his son into the White House, and what happened when he didn't deliver.

Another hard reality of the candidate selection process is that if the system can be bent in various ways...money, influence, etc...then it will be. The risk then is that one ends up with a pool of candidates whose history and background won't stand up to the light of day and public scrutiny.

 

There is an old 'joke', a put down of of people from a rival town or country, that goes like this:

Q. Why will the Second Coming not take place in (insert town or country here).

A. Because they couldn't find a virgin and 3 wise men.

 

I suspect the little filtered pool of leadership candidates in many places is further reduced because so many of the people who have fought their way through that far have compromised themselves in various ways in order to get as far as they have.

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Money plays an enormous part in the US system of electing a President. Taxes are a big issue. The candidate may have little ability or skills other than  a persona but if they are a successful front guy for powerful vested interests he/she will get the "financial"  and political  support needed. Trump has divided the US more than most do and he's used divisive issue and big promises to hold a rusted on CORE of almost "worshippers" in whose eyes his character faults mean nothing . America seems to look for Saviours with a strong "God want's you to be RICH  and USA has a duty to be great and rule the world and preserve it's supposed Superior standard of Living and manner of doing things generally. 

  The example it now presents to the world is not of such nature to be convincing any more. IF it ever was. Especially after that appalling Debate??? we saw yesterday., and International TRUST will disappear. Nev

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International trust has been eroding for a long time now and based on the international press reports today, it has largely disappeared. If Trump does lose and he can get his disaffected supporters to rally in support their descent into chaos will be complete, and it may only be the military leaders who can bring order back. They have already discussed the possibility of taking over from Trump a couple of years ago & with the divisions seemingly widening, martial law may be on the cards.

 

Trump can see the writing on the wall so losing is not an option for him. If he refuses to go & they evict him, there are hundreds of lawsuits waiting in the wings not to mention the  multiple millions in loans that have been used to prop up his failing business ventures that are due for repayment within the next year or so. He has already been chapter 11 bankrupted 6 times but as a malignant narcissist and ultimate con man, he has managed to keep just a small step ahead but it may all now come to a head.

 

Whatever the outcome it is not going to be pretty.

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The presidential debate was the most un-presidential debate you could ever envisage. It was ruled by Trump from the beginning, using his trademark of initiating chaos and then keeping the opposition off-balance.

Trump interrupted Biden 73 times with abrasive interjections designed to rattle Biden - which he did, very successfully.

 

The problem is, the debate wasn't a debate because the person or people who were charged with keeping control of the debate and ensuring the participants followed the rules of debating, failed to do so - miserably.

As a result, the debate turned into an uncontrolled free-for-all, with little logic or reasoning behind the participants statements, as they failed to keep on track.

 

Trump specialises in rapid reversals of position, statements that make no linguistic sense, and are contradictory within each sentence. He stops mid-sentence, leaving the subject hanging, as he switches to another subject.

Trump truly is chaos personified, in his modus operandi and in his lack of vision and constant firing of underlings, the instant he decides they are worthless to him.

 

The problem is, while all this goes on, the real controllers of Americas direction - the U.S. global corporations, and the coterie of super-rich individuals whose wealth increases exponentially each year - regardless of who is the Presidents chair - happily enjoy their highly-privileged and untouchable, unelected positions of incredible power.

Edited by onetrack
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24 minutes ago, kgwilson said:

I+nternational trust has been eroding for a long time now and based on the international press reports today, it has largely disappeared. If Trump does lose and he can get his disaffected supporters to rally in support their descent into chaos will be complete,

I said some time ago that empires only have a relatively short life span before internal dissent and power plays rot them from the core, allowing other outside groups to break through the protective walls. The Ancient Middle Eastern empires lasted for long times because of the low speed of transport and communication. Since 1800 we have seen these two things speed up and he lives of empires shorten.

 

Are wwe seeing the beginning of the end of the Empire of the USA?

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I wasn't aware but was recently told that Abe Lincoln was as divisive as Trump. He wanted to do what half the electors didn't want and he pushed it through. It led to a civil war. 

He is very highly regarded today but apparently was viewed like Trump in his own time. And of course assassinated as a result.

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The key difference is that Lincoln was well educated, eloquent, considered a Statesman, a Lawyer and AFAIK didn't sack everyone who didn't agree with him. He also sought to heal the nation after the civil war through reconciliation but as is still the case there were plenty of very hard nosed confederates around & one of them assassinated him.

 

A couple of years ago Trump said "Did you know that Lincoln was a Republican, not many people know that" which really means "I didn't know that".

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Trump has too much to hide to risk exposure by losing this election. It's going to be extremely NASTY. What a $#1t example of how to behave for the rest of the world to have in plain sight.  US credibility is gone forever thanks to the Republican's opportunism that anyone's behaviour is OK as long as he's OURS. A DIVIDED County by description has limited opportunities to  advance. Honest Self assessment is anti American. IF you criticise anything you are unpatriotic. Total BS. Nev

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The Republican Part (the GOP) was founded in 1854 by opponents of the Kansas–Nebraska Act, which allowed for the potential expansion of slavery into the western territories. The party supported classical liberalism, opposed the expansion of slavery, and supported economic reform. After 1912, the Party underwent a social ideological shift to the right. Republican Party ideology is American conservatism, which incorporates both economic policies and social values. The GOP supports lower taxes, free market capitalism, restrictions on immigration, increased military spending, gun rights, restrictions on abortion, deregulation and restrictions on labour unions.

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On 29/09/2020 at 9:09 PM, Garfly said:

 

Hey SP, I recall seeing pics of y'self sporting a moe snapped when you were soaring into the seventies.

 

(You know, the era of Dennis Lillee et al.)  

 

As I recall, the effect was very similar to this:

 

1273696460_SPlookalike.thumb.png.2030dc9219cacf07adfabc5f9de23285.png

 

So, in answer to your question ... nah, maybe not.    😉

 

 

Correct Captain Gazza, Sully has everyones respect. Anybody who defends or tries to legitimise Trump has no credibility  

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